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CSG Ups Its Game with a New Label and Revised Grading Scale!
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41 posts in this topic

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On 4/16/2022 at 9:09 AM, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Question in regards to reslabbing.

Got a Juan Soto back as Pristine 10 when the Perfect 10 was only if you purchased sub grades. If I reholder does it get reviewed for Perfect 10, or do I have to regrade for that one .5 sub determination that I previously would've had to pay for.

This is the information that I was provided by our graders:

Nothing is being re-graded when it is submitted for crack and cross, with the exception of any Pristine 10 green label will be reviewed for a possible Perfect 10 black label.

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On 4/16/2022 at 1:52 AM, northkorea said:

If that is what happened, I would be, personally, happy. That means that CSG owes you a check for the downgrade (under the grade guarantee) and won't charge you for the reholder fee. I understand that you'd rather have the higher grade, but at least they're giving a true grade... which implies that they are actually regrading the cards, which is excellent news.

In this specific case, I really hope that Ryan is wrong, as I appreciate that they are correcting grading mistakes.

Thanks for the wonderful, insightful, ever-wise opinion!

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On 4/16/2022 at 3:09 AM, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Question in regards to reslabbing.

Got a Juan Soto back as Pristine 10 when the Perfect 10 was only if you purchased sub grades. If I reholder does it get reviewed for Perfect 10, or do I have to regrade for that one .5 sub determination that I previously would've had to pay for.

The most recent official response is that Pristine 10 (without subs) would be considered for Perfect 10. Personally, I think this is a *tad* unfair, since a 9.5 centering 10*3, which would be the very definition of black Perfect would get the 10 GM designation.

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On 4/17/2022 at 6:00 AM, The_Reverend2831694433746 said:

I think the prices for the green label Pristine will go up in value because that is a grade that is no longer available. I will not reholder my Tiger Woods UD CSG PRISTINE 10 because the card looks dole on the old green case with the green card border. 

I agree with you The Reverend!  I am not re-holdering my Pristine 10's either.  I think they look great as they are and, you're spot on with them being of higher value due to the new grading scale.  I have some Melo and Edwards RC's in the Pristine grade and the look dope.  One love brother and Happy Easter!

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On 4/16/2022 at 9:44 PM, northkorea said:

The most recent official response is that Pristine 10 (without subs) would be considered for Perfect 10. Personally, I think this is a *tad* unfair, since a 9.5 centering 10*3, which would be the very definition of black Perfect would get the 10 GM designation.

Yeah, haven't checked sub form to see if Perfect 10 minimum is an option. I'd rather keep it in a Pristine 10 case than get downgraded to Gem Mint on a resub lol.

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Just received an 88 card submission yesterday (via digital notification) and, overall, I was pleased.  The cards were received on April 4th and are being shipped out today.  For a bulk submission, that is pretty fast and I am not complaining about the turnaround time given that some people are STILL waiting on PSA to return their cards from over a year ago!  The CSG slabs with the new flip are a significant improvement IMO.  The slabs were crystal clear and clean (no damage, scuffs, etc.) and the best in the hobby IMO.  There were a few pleasant surprises in the grades and none of the lower grades were surprising to me.  CSG has the most valid and reliable grading in the hobby imo.  Here is a breakdown of the grades (attached).

Overall, I am happy with this submission!  CSG is THE play for me with cards that are valued at $500 or less and will likely remain that way for awhile.  If it's a $500+ flip, I am sticking with PSA.  If not, or if it's a PC that I want to hold for awhile, it's CSG all the way!  SGC and BGS just aren't my dish (not disrespect intended as I know some people LOVE SGC and BGS).

I went on my YouTube channel which is called "TE2 Edge Sports Cards" and shared, verbally, the results from this most recent bulk submission.  As soon as I receive the slabs, I'll be putting them on my My Slabs landing site for sale.  I've already put a number of the slabs with the new flip up and they look nice imo: myslabs.to/b2538624-eac9-4ffd-95b2-cf8af471f7f2  

CSG is my long term play.  The Fanatics, Luber, Rubin, and eBay authentication pieces are all reasons why I like CSG in addition to them having the best looking slabs in the business.  I am not concerned about resale either.  It's only going to be a bit before CSG slabs leap frog SGC (they're already well past HGA) and BGS.  I don't ever see CSG leap frogging PSA BUT I can envision a time when CSG slabs are akin to having a high end SUV like a fully loaded Lincoln Navigator compared to a Honda Pilot.  Sure, the Honda Pilot is great (I own one, so I should know!), reliable, and reasonably priced, but who wouldn't rather own a Navi?  CSG has things to improve upon though and one BIG one I've given feedback on is improving their communication and making it more timely to dealers, collectors, and investors.

Overall, though, I am pleased and will continue to submit cards to CSG.  Three questions I have:

1.  Does anyone do group subs with CSG and what has your experience with that been like?

2.  When will I find out what happened with the 54 Spahn and the 55 Mossi?  Each was downgraded without any warning or communication and most folks have been under the impression that if it's less than a 9.5, the grade remains the same.  That's been the communication across the industry.  I have some higher end cards that I'd like reholdered into the new slabs but I don't want them downgraded at all.  It's too risky!  Can the administrator of this group thread respond?

3.  When will CSG be, if ever, developing an app?  I love the PSA and PWCC app's and CSG needs to get one out to folks.  Is that in the works?

 

Thank you,

Leiataua Dr. Jon Peterson

TE2 Consulting and Edge Sports Cards

 

 

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On 4/17/2022 at 11:29 AM, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Yeah, haven't checked sub form to see if Perfect 10 minimum is an option. I'd rather keep it in a Pristine 10 case than get downgraded to Gem Mint on a resub lol.

You won't be able to do that. Fairly certain that they would need to see the card under high resolution imaging to validate a 10 surface grade.

The only way I can see a min grade perfect 10 would be a 10*3/8+ centering green label. That would, in theory, ensure all the other subs are 10s, and 8+ centering on green scale has a possible upgrade to 10 if the 8 was solely due to reverse centering.

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On 4/20/2022 at 1:44 PM, Leiataua Dr. Jon said:

Just received an 88 card submission yesterday (via digital notification) and, overall, I was pleased.  The cards were received on April 4th and are being shipped out today.  For a bulk submission, that is pretty fast and I am not complaining about the turnaround time given that some people are STILL waiting on PSA to return their cards from over a year ago!  The CSG slabs with the new flip are a significant improvement IMO.  The slabs were crystal clear and clean (no damage, scuffs, etc.) and the best in the hobby IMO.  There were a few pleasant surprises in the grades and none of the lower grades were surprising to me.  CSG has the most valid and reliable grading in the hobby imo.  Here is a breakdown of the grades (attached).

Overall, I am happy with this submission!  CSG is THE play for me with cards that are valued at $500 or less and will likely remain that way for awhile.  If it's a $500+ flip, I am sticking with PSA.  If not, or if it's a PC that I want to hold for awhile, it's CSG all the way!  SGC and BGS just aren't my dish (not disrespect intended as I know some people LOVE SGC and BGS).

I went on my YouTube channel which is called "TE2 Edge Sports Cards" and shared, verbally, the results from this most recent bulk submission.  As soon as I receive the slabs, I'll be putting them on my My Slabs landing site for sale.  I've already put a number of the slabs with the new flip up and they look nice imo: myslabs.to/b2538624-eac9-4ffd-95b2-cf8af471f7f2  

CSG is my long term play.  The Fanatics, Luber, Rubin, and eBay authentication pieces are all reasons why I like CSG in addition to them having the best looking slabs in the business.  I am not concerned about resale either.  It's only going to be a bit before CSG slabs leap frog SGC (they're already well past HGA) and BGS.  I don't ever see CSG leap frogging PSA BUT I can envision a time when CSG slabs are akin to having a high end SUV like a fully loaded Lincoln Navigator compared to a Honda Pilot.  Sure, the Honda Pilot is great (I own one, so I should know!), reliable, and reasonably priced, but who wouldn't rather own a Navi?  CSG has things to improve upon though and one BIG one I've given feedback on is improving their communication and making it more timely to dealers, collectors, and investors.

Overall, though, I am pleased and will continue to submit cards to CSG.  Three questions I have:

1.  Does anyone do group subs with CSG and what has your experience with that been like?

2.  When will I find out what happened with the 54 Spahn and the 55 Mossi?  Each was downgraded without any warning or communication and most folks have been under the impression that if it's less than a 9.5, the grade remains the same.  That's been the communication across the industry.  I have some higher end cards that I'd like reholdered into the new slabs but I don't want them downgraded at all.  It's too risky!  Can the administrator of this group thread respond?

3.  When will CSG be, if ever, developing an app?  I love the PSA and PWCC app's and CSG needs to get one out to folks.  Is that in the works?

 

Thank you,

Leiataua Dr. Jon Peterson

TE2 Consulting and Edge Sports Cards

 

 

Screen Shot 2022-04-20 at 12.27.09 PM.png

Screen Shot 2022-04-20 at 12.27.26 PM.png

Screen Shot 2022-04-20 at 12.27.42 PM.png

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I followed up again today to see what the status was on reviewing your 54 Spahn and 55 Mossi cards. The latest I received from Customer Service was that our graders were contacted to provide further insight.  I am sorry that I don't have an explanation for you yet, but I will keep following up until I do.

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On 4/20/2022 at 1:39 PM, CGCRyan said:

I followed up again today to see what the status was on reviewing your 54 Spahn and 55 Mossi cards. The latest I received from Customer Service was that our graders were contacted to provide further insight.  I am sorry that I don't have an explanation for you yet, but I will keep following up until I do.

Hey brother, that's all that I can ask for.  I appreciate your quick response and follow through on this...I look forward to hearing what you come up with.  peace!

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On 4/20/2022 at 2:30 PM, northkorea said:

You won't be able to do that. Fairly certain that they would need to see the card under high resolution imaging to validate a 10 surface grade.

The only way I can see a min grade perfect 10 would be a 10*3/8+ centering green label. That would, in theory, ensure all the other subs are 10s, and 8+ centering on green scale has a possible upgrade to 10 if the 8 was solely due to reverse centering.

Through the previous grading scale I assumed a Pristine 10 was more in line with a BG 10, and perfect was a black label, with 9.5 being Gem Mint. 9.5, 10, and black labels command vastly different prices. If 9.5s are now 10 GM, I struggle to figure out exactly where the previous Pristine 10s fall in this unless the reholder on 9.5 GM is now Mint+. Feel like a Pristine 10 going to Gem is a big downgrade if previous 9.5s are now Gem Mint 10.

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On 4/21/2022 at 2:58 AM, Yeahiwasder4dat said:

Through the previous grading scale I assumed a Pristine 10 was more in line with a BG 10, and perfect was a black label, with 9.5 being Gem Mint. 9.5, 10, and black labels command vastly different prices. If 9.5s are now 10 GM, I struggle to figure out exactly where the previous Pristine 10s fall in this unless the reholder on 9.5 GM is now Mint+. Feel like a Pristine 10 going to Gem is a big downgrade if previous 9.5s are now Gem Mint 10.

Yes.

Just think of it this way (although admittedly inexact and likely incorrect):

Old Green GM is new Black GM.

Old Green Pristine is absorbed into new Black GM and Perfect. Pristine no longer exists.

New Black Mint+, somewhat impossibly, has no corresponding Green grade.

What, more than likely, is happening (though CSG will never admit to this) is:

Green Perfect is truly 100% all around. As such, it clearly would qualify as new Black Perfect.

Some Green 10 Pristine (9.5 centering) would also qualify as Black Perfect, as would some Green 9.5 GM  (9 centering and 10*3). In addition, there's a possibility that some Green 9.0 Mint (8/8.5 centering due to reverse centering issues and 10*3) could qualify as Black 10 Perfect.

Most old Green 9.5 GM (excluding new Black 10 Perfect, as explained above) would now grade out at Black 10 GM. Some Green 9.5 GM (9.0 [not centering] and 9.5*3) would be the new Black 9.5 Mint+.

Additionally, some old Green 9.0 Mint would be Black 9.5 Mint+. These would likely be cards with 9.0*2 subs, if one of those was centering.

Beyond that, most cards would translate to the equivalent tier on the new scale.

The only change in scales is centering definitions, so there might be some "crack and sub" (CSG should be reasonable and not require cards with subs to be cracked out) opportunities for upgrades.

Just my observations.

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On 4/21/2022 at 9:57 AM, northkorea said:

Yes.

Just think of it this way (although admittedly inexact and likely incorrect):

Old Green GM is new Black GM.

Old Green Pristine is absorbed into new Black GM and Perfect. Pristine no longer exists.

New Black Mint+, somewhat impossibly, has no corresponding Green grade.

What, more than likely, is happening (though CSG will never admit to this) is:

Green Perfect is truly 100% all around. As such, it clearly would qualify as new Black Perfect.

Some Green 10 Pristine (9.5 centering) would also qualify as Black Perfect, as would some Green 9.5 GM  (9 centering and 10*3). In addition, there's a possibility that some Green 9.0 Mint (8/8.5 centering due to reverse centering issues and 10*3) could qualify as Black 10 Perfect.

Most old Green 9.5 GM (excluding new Black 10 Perfect, as explained above) would now grade out at Black 10 GM. Some Green 9.5 GM (9.0 [not centering] and 9.5*3) would be the new Black 9.5 Mint+.

Additionally, some old Green 9.0 Mint would be Black 9.5 Mint+. These would likely be cards with 9.0*2 subs, if one of those was centering.

Beyond that, most cards would translate to the equivalent tier on the new scale.

The only change in scales is centering definitions, so there might be some "crack and sub" (CSG should be reasonable and not require cards with subs to be cracked out) opportunities for upgrades.

Just my observations.

My Main problem is that 9 mint to 9.5 mint plus.  I think there should be a very clear "these are the subgrades that will translate to a 9.5".  I have a 10, 9.5, 9,9, which sounds to me like an obvious black 9.5, but I can't get anyone at CSG to confirm this.  No chance I'm sending it in with the chance of getting a black 9 back without subgrades (while also paying a full grading fee even though it's already slabbed with sub-grades).

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On 4/21/2022 at 10:55 AM, original_otis said:

My Main problem is that 9 mint to 9.5 mint plus.  I think there should be a very clear "these are the subgrades that will translate to a 9.5".  I have a 10, 9.5, 9,9, which sounds to me like an obvious black 9.5, but I can't get anyone at CSG to confirm this.  No chance I'm sending it in with the chance of getting a black 9 back without subgrades (while also paying a full grading fee even though it's already slabbed with sub-grades).

The official CSG position would be a Black 9. If one of the 9s was centering, that *should* be a Black 9.5 Mint+ (since the Green 9 centering is a Black 10 centering), but CSG officially says Black 9.

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On 4/21/2022 at 11:57 AM, northkorea said:

Yes.

Just think of it this way (although admittedly inexact and likely incorrect):

Old Green GM is new Black GM.

Old Green Pristine is absorbed into new Black GM and Perfect. Pristine no longer exists.

New Black Mint+, somewhat impossibly, has no corresponding Green grade.

What, more than likely, is happening (though CSG will never admit to this) is:

Green Perfect is truly 100% all around. As such, it clearly would qualify as new Black Perfect.

Some Green 10 Pristine (9.5 centering) would also qualify as Black Perfect, as would some Green 9.5 GM  (9 centering and 10*3). In addition, there's a possibility that some Green 9.0 Mint (8/8.5 centering due to reverse centering issues and 10*3) could qualify as Black 10 Perfect.

Most old Green 9.5 GM (excluding new Black 10 Perfect, as explained above) would now grade out at Black 10 GM. Some Green 9.5 GM (9.0 [not centering] and 9.5*3) would be the new Black 9.5 Mint+.

Additionally, some old Green 9.0 Mint would be Black 9.5 Mint+. These would likely be cards with 9.0*2 subs, if one of those was centering.

Beyond that, most cards would translate to the equivalent tier on the new scale.

The only change in scales is centering definitions, so there might be some "crack and sub" (CSG should be reasonable and not require cards with subs to be cracked out) opportunities for upgrades.

Just my observations.

That explanation was helpful.  Thank you!

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On 4/20/2022 at 1:39 PM, CGCRyan said:

I followed up again today to see what the status was on reviewing your 54 Spahn and 55 Mossi cards. The latest I received from Customer Service was that our graders were contacted to provide further insight.  I am sorry that I don't have an explanation for you yet, but I will keep following up until I do.

Ryan: can you also check and see what the policy is on sending in Green Pristine 10's?  Will they be regraded as well and if so will they be regraded as Black Perfect 10's or Black Gem Mint 10's?  I have a few Green Pristine 10's but don't want to send them in if there's any chance that they'll be downgraded to a Black Gem Mint 10.  Thanks for you help!

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On 4/22/2022 at 2:45 AM, Leiataua Dr. Jon said:

Ryan: can you also check and see what the policy is on sending in Green Pristine 10's?  Will they be regraded as well and if so will they be regraded as Black Perfect 10's or Black Gem Mint 10's?  I have a few Green Pristine 10's but don't want to send them in if there's any chance that they'll be downgraded to a Black Gem Mint 10.  Thanks for you help!

High probability that they will regrade "down" to Black 10 GM. Do they have subs?

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On 3/26/2022 at 11:09 PM, CGCRyan said:

With the ReHolder Service, any green label CSG card graded 9 or below, will be given the same grade in the new black label. Green label Gem Mint 9.5s will cross to Gem Mint 10s in the new black label.  Pristine 10s will be reviewed for a possible Perfect 10 black label.

When submitting for reholder do the slabs need to be put in order as we do with grading.

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