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REALLY NEED OPINIONS! SOMETHING SMELLS ROTTEN
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77 posts in this topic

On 2/23/2022 at 1:57 PM, AM Cards said:

I sent out a 50 card bulk in mid-December and it has already been shipped.  I sent it in mid-December, so it wasn't sitting long before being marked as scheduled for grading.  They were pretty up to date at that point on opening packages.  Is this becoming the new norm, or just a lucky break for me.  We'll see - I just sent in another bulk order rec'd on 2/11, so we'll see how long that takes.

CSG7312239121
12/23/21
50
305
Bulk (50-card minimum)
2/22/22

 

My turnaround time from when they received the cards to when they posted my grades was literally 24 hours. How carefully did they look at the cards. I love the speed but that seems crazy and haphazard.  

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On 2/24/2022 at 7:53 AM, Cardsharp1 said:

WOW John Fisher those are some shockingly harsh grades. Your cards look better than that to me.

@Cardsharp1 - just following up with you on the Strawberry, Leslie and Jordan grades I received.  I emailed CSG to ask for notes or rationale for the grades and received this message, "Thank you for reaching out to CSG. Unfortunately, there are no Grader's notes available for your cards at this time. Although we cannot advise on why a card received a specific grade, we can assure you each card was reviewed by multiple Graders before the final grade was agreed upon."

This is unique to me as I have inquired in the past to both ISA and SGC regarding grades and both were able to provide me with a grader's notes or reasons for the grade. In fact, in both cases, they were absolutely correct and I missed something when I looked at the card and thought it was worthy of grading. (one time there was a crease all the way across the back of a card - turns out I had 2 copies and submitted the wrong one). Anyway, I am sending these three cards to SGC for a re-grade.  I'll let you know how it comes back.  I have looked all three of them over and, again, being a 40 veteran of card collecting, have found nothing to warrant such low grades. Will keep you in the loop.  Happy collecting!

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On 3/5/2022 at 11:12 AM, Matt Zai said:

I sent in 90 cards and they have already graded them....def disappointed in many of the grades.  The crazy part is I KNOW one card from a 1986 Topps football cards had a bent corner, BUT YET IT IS COMING BACK with the highest grade in the bunch......follow up with upload.  

And what is no grade next to a near perfect 1975 Robin Yount?? being sent back, but has no grade......

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On 2/24/2022 at 6:12 PM, I dont have one said:

You can have whatever opinion you like about the grading here. No big deal to me. That said Im also entitled to my take on it. I’m knowledgeable and experienced on the subject of card grading. Plainly put consumers spending their money vote with their wallets and CSG will never get any more business from me. I’ve tried a few different ones now but SGC will be the only other service I ever consider besides PSA going forward. For now I’ll sit back and wait for PSA to reopen their value service. The grades there are more fair and the resale values higher on top of it. I should have done that to begin with. Impatience cost me. Lesson learned. 

That helps me. I been in cards for 30 plus years. I have about 5 minutes of expertise in grading cards. I just decided to sell stuff. Graded brings more $. My initial grading attempts, well, totally had my head up my .

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On 2/23/2022 at 11:29 PM, Fredguy11:11 said:

I sent in 11 cards for economy turnaround 40 days.  CSG received them less than a week after I mailed them out. They received on them on Feb 22nd.  In submission tracking I had the gradesand a return shipping date to me of Feb 24th. As I write this it still 45 minutes until it is actually Feb 24th. My cards went through the entire CSG grading process in 24 hours. Someone is yanking my chain. That is not possible. In addition all the grades were significantly lower than expected. Can someone explain how the highest sub-graded Namath card got the lowest overall grade??? By far the allegedly best centered card by 2.5 full points and all other subs the same or close enough got a lower grade.  See below.  Am I nuckin futs or do I have an issue here? Any thoughts greatly appreciated.

 

Namath grades.PNG

turnaround.PNG

you can only get a half a grade higher then your lowest subgrade! you do not divide and get the average, for example if you take a perfect card corners 10, edges 10, centering 10 but take a knife and carve and X onto the surface your not gonna get a 7!  your gonna get a 1 or a 2 because there is a big X carved into the surface doesnt matter that the rest of the card is perfect because no one wants to buy a csg 7 with a huge X carved into the surface!!! subgrades are a guide but gotta look at the card as whole 

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On 2/24/2022 at 9:05 AM, Kon_Jelly said:

You say "horrible" but pretty much everyone else would say "accurate." 

Those of us who know how to evaluate cards before sending in are rarely surprised by the grades CSG gives. 

I’ve submitted over 200 cards and most fall at a fair grade.  I have about 30% gem mint with most falling at a 9.0.  I’ve collected most of my life and keep my cards as clean and clear as possible before I send them in.  I’m sure most collectors would agree that doing some research and looking at the cards before sending in helps with what we as collectors should expect back from csg.

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On 2/24/2022 at 4:08 AM, I dont have one said:

I sent a 50 card bulk order in January 11 and it’s already been shipped so it doesn’t appear you were just lucky. I haven’t received it yet but after looking at the online grades I’m in no hurry. What good is fast when their grades are so horrible? Outrageously tough and I totally disagree with their scoring. I’ll have to break them all out of their holders and send them somewhere else now for regrading.  First and last time I’ll send cards here. Total waste of $1,000+ 

Honestly it sucks when you get cards back that aren't as conditioned as you thought, but you got to understand that these people really look at them with a fine point comb and takes a deep look at the surfaces and corners. 

My only advice if it's this much of an issue, don't get the cards graded. Older cards always seem to get lower grades, it sucks, but it' the truth. That is why 10 are always worth thousands. 

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Not to beat a dead horse but I’ve sent hundreds and hundreds of cards over the past few years to 4 different grading companies (PSA, SGC & HGA being the other 3) so I have extensive experience regarding what grades to expect. I use a lighted magnified jewelers loupe to inspect my cards before I send them to any of these graders. Do I expect all 10’s? Of course not. Can I miss something on a few of the cards out of a 50 card submission that they pick up? Of course I could. But these CSG grades were way out of line to the low side. I don’t miss on all 50 cards. Never happens. Everyone’s entitled to their own opinions and to send their cards where they want or not send them at all. After my experience here I personally will never use CSG again. 

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Just here to chime in saying that my bulk of 52 (all modern) cards is complete. 
I harshly pre-selected them and the results were actually better than I expected for most, and only worse than expected for a few. :


- 6 10s 

- 25 9.5s 

-17 9s


- 4 8.5s 

Nearly 60% gem mint or better, my best yet between CSG and CGC.

I had in mind that "perfect" cards in my mind were actually going to be 9.5s at best, so I'm pumped that 6 exceeded that expectation. 
Of course there are a few 9s and 8.5s that I thought would be higher

Also, one of the 9.5s was a LeBron draft pick card from 2003-4 :) sent 2, the other got a 9
 

Edited by JohnBurke
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I received an 11 card economy submission back in 12 days, 04/02-04/14. The grades were as expected. I got an 8, and 2 8.5 on cards that I knew were tough grades, but were PC Cards, both with noticeable chipping (thick cards). I received 1 10 and 2 9.5 grades, the 10 was a huge surprise being as it is a condition sensitive card I figured to be a 9.5. I totally am sold on the new slab and if the hobby bought the card and not just a slab, I know all about ROI, people would not be complaining as much. If top ROI is what you want, I think that will change over time with CSG, PAY THE INFLATED PRICE with PSA. I use all of the top 4 grading services based on the card. I tested CSG at the beginning and they have the clearest slabs in the industry. If all of the influencers suddenly started pumping CSG as they did with PSA, remember BGS was the top grading company before that began, you would see a lot more CSG slabs in cases. Except for that, there is no reason a card in a PSA slab should sell for 5 to 10 times more than a slab from another company. Buy the card not the slab! Here is a question, “would any of us pay 5 to 10 times more for a slab without a card in it? 

Edited by The_Reverend283
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The added value when reselling doest seem to be worth the $20 grading fee. With lower grades, nobody will pay a premium for CSG graded cards. Simple as that, unfortunately. It seems like a great company, but they add minimal value. As a buyer, it's nice. As a seller, pass

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On 4/18/2022 at 10:10 AM, Jtp1389 said:

The added value when reselling doest seem to be worth the $20 grading fee. With lower grades, nobody will pay a premium for CSG graded cards. Simple as that, unfortunately. It seems like a great company, but they add minimal value. As a buyer, it's nice. As a seller, pass

Minimal value? They don’t add any value. At all. Ever. Their 9.5’s and 10’s sell for substantially less than PSA and anything lower than that actually causes the value to go down from raw card value in most cases. CSG 9 and less you won’t even get your grading fee + shipping and insurance back on eBay when it sells. It’s a loss on the grading costs and you give the card away for free. Bottom line it makes no financial sense to use CSG at all if you’re selling. Don’t waste your money here. 

Edited by I dont have one
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To explain how CSG deals with subs and the final grade...

I'm fairly certain that CSG will allow a step (half grade) above the lowest subgrade for the overall grade. If the two lowest subgrades are the same number, then the overall grade will be that grade.

So, basically, if you have a 1/10/10/10 card, that would be a 1.5. If you have a 1/1/10/10 card, that would be a 1.

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On 4/18/2022 at 7:47 AM, I dont have one said:

Minimal value? They don’t add any value. At all. Ever. Their 9.5’s and 10’s sell for substantially less than PSA and anything lower than that actually causes the value to go down from raw card value in most cases. CSG 9 and less you won’t even get your grading fee + shipping and insurance back on eBay when it sells. It’s a loss on the grading costs and you give the card away for free. Bottom line it makes no financial sense to use CSG at all if you’re selling. Don’t waste your money here. 

I'm not sure I agree with this. I grasp what you're implying, but I think it only applies to high print run base cards... ergo: commons. A big part of the reason why sub 9 graded cards get "less than raw" is because most sellers on eBay define raw as NrMt/Mt+. Sellers will use this definition, even with cards that would grade out as a 6 with any of the top TPGs. Essentially, buyers are paying 8.5 money for 6 cards, just because they are "pack fresh!!!!!" raw cards. If you truly compared apples to apples, honesty creates a huge marketplace bias.

A huge part of PSA's value comes from the added value of the registry. With CSG having registry awards, hopefully that offsets even a small amount of the registry bias.

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On 4/18/2022 at 3:22 PM, northkorea said:

I'm not sure I agree with this. I grasp what you're implying, but I think it only applies to high print run base cards... ergo: commons. A big part of the reason why sub 9 graded cards get "less than raw" is because most sellers on eBay define raw as NrMt/Mt+. Sellers will use this definition, even with cards that would grade out as a 6 with any of the top TPGs. Essentially, buyers are paying 8.5 money for 6 cards, just because they are "pack fresh!!!!!" raw cards. If you truly compared apples to apples, honesty creates a huge marketplace bias.

A huge part of PSA's value comes from the added value of the registry. With CSG having registry awards, hopefully that offsets even a small amount of the registry bias.

I’d somewhat agree with your take on why raws are worth more than all CSG grades under 9.5  But nonetheless they’re worth more so it is what it is. And for the most part high print run base cards are pretty much the only ones even worth sending to CSG because the fees are a cheaper. But if they are going to devalue the great majority of them below raw value why even send those? What earthly reason would you have for sending a high value card that you’re almost certain will score a ten to CSG instead of paying the extra to send it to PSA? First of all you subject yourself to their ridiculous surface grades opening yourself up to possibly getting a 8.5 or 9 that makes it worthless and needing regrading elsewhere. If it does get the CSG 9.5 or 10 the PSA ten is still going to get you back a lot more on resale than the CSG 10 will. The greater return will far exceed any extra cost you incur to send it to PSA instead. I’ve yet to hear a solid dollars and cents argument why you’d want to send cards here given the current grade scale / ROI reality. You have to be wishing on a star that sometime in the distant future public sentiment turns against PSA and towards CSG? We’re all entitled to speculate and have an opinion on that but I personally don’t see it happening.  Seems to be some of the fanboys here willing to go down with that ship though. To each his own. 

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VERY INTERESTING...I SENT IT A 500 CARD COLLECTION OF MINT,  UNTOUCHED SLICES OF HEAVEN. CSG me like a $2 dollar whore. I say we come together and revolt. Boycott all the grading organizations, they're still using the same method they used in prehistoric ages. Just because "some guy" is a certified card grader doesnt mean a damn thing other than that guy has a strong resume in the card grading industry. And Im sure this post will cause some to lash out at me for being so inconsiderate but come on guys, y'all are smarter than this. Boycott all Sports Card grading and they will collapse. Its that simpe. 

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